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 Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.

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lepapillonrouge
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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Wed Dec 29, 2010 1:45 pm

Random...but...

Have we ever figured out how the -bleep- Zephyr can see anything with that mask?
XD Laser vision?

Oh, I guess another thing we could talk about...
So like, after...two years or so of he being mentioned in RoT, we FINALLY see what Aldius looks like...not that you crazy Oswald fangirls give one or anything Rolling Eyes . But still, there's gotta be a reason why azure bothered to make a picture of him with Vessy.

- comparison purposes with Thanos?
- will he show up in MoGF?
- Or maybe he'll show up in backstory :DD?
...orz I'm probably the only one who kinda wants to see Oswald's backstory with Vestoria and Aldius went down, just because.

Oh for you people who like Vestoria reincarnation Len theory:

Because my internet failed at life until I got a new router, I was replaying RotA (Volg's path), and before I forgot what you're supposed to say to Cyrus to convince him to do the ritual to save Volg's life, I remember when Thanos took over/killed Vessy, he said something like that she will be reincarnated, but as a mortal. Now...who knows, this may apply to Len, or it may apply to some other person.
Now, I don't know how reincarnation works for mortals in Fantasia, but at least for demons, it appears that they seem to retain their appearance and personality. If that is true, reincarnation theory might not be something that could apply to Len, because, let's face it, she does not act a thing like Vessy, at all.
Although, you've gotta admit Vessy did have to be a bit of a...well, she was pretty mean, messing with Oswald and all for Aldius's sake >_> But, the way she reacted, well, she might have regretted it. Thankfully, in RotA, they seem to be on better terms.

I wish there was more things to talk about...especially about the other characters...

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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Thu Dec 30, 2010 12:30 am

Lepap, the mask is see-through inside out. XD It has some kind of holes for the eyes, doesn't it?

I am not quite sure... Did Clara draw the piccy of Aldius and Vestoria for MoGF or for Before Requiem? I wonder.

If it's for MoGF... Then a connection between the gods and the new characters is obvious. I doubt it's about Thanos, because we know he's Oswald's other self... What comes to my mind is that Lenarche is somehow Aldius and Vestoria's child. Which is weird. And kind of... impossible, since they died ages ago and now she's 17...

Seeing as the other selves are shaped by one's true hopes and wishes and Thanos (Os' other self) looks like Aldius, it's possible that Len is Aldius' other self, that's why she resembles Vestoria... But Oswald killed Aldius and his other self. But still, Al is immortal and, as you say, Vestoria is meant to reincarnate as a mortal, why wouldn't that be valid for Aldius? And then we have Thanos saying that he won't die as long as Oswald is alive, which leads to the question "Can other selves reincarnate when their originals do?"

Apparently they can, given that in the True Ending of RoT Oswald dies, and after years, we see Thanos again.

Man, this was confusing. And kind of takes me nowhere. Really hope it makes some sense at least.
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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Thu Dec 30, 2010 8:13 am

But then again, Oswald said he didn't really die back then in ROT...
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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Thu Dec 30, 2010 9:02 am

I don't know much about Len parents or something. But, it looks like she is Old Hag (Vestoria) reincarnation. I don't mean about she is not looks like her in mind. But, she get Old Hag physical appearance. (Her face, hair and so on) There are many type of reincarnation you know....... reincarnation it self is something like reborn again, so it didn't mean she must looks like her past self perfectly. (It looks like Len get Old Hag memory and body)

Aldius......... In my head he might be show up in MoGF rather Before Requiem. (If that true I want to make Avalon scared to the dead. I still remember that Avalon scared to ghost) It makes more sense if he show in there. So it prove my first theory. (Another eternal love, bleh!) Aldius will always protect Old Hag. So, because Len is Old Hag reincarnation, Aldius protect her. Happy or not, he will show up in MoGF if that true.

If I not wrong. (or my head fail me again) in the true endings Oswald said something beyond this line. (I insert Cheryl too for more complete and some....... line)
Spoiler:
 
It prove that Oswald is not die! That's why Thanos could show up in RoTA and be the main villain there. (I wonder if he go to Villain school and learn "How To be a Good Villain")

It will be more funny if Zephyr is Aldius reincarnation! It will be worth see it. Aldius reincarnation vs Other self whom looks like Aldius to get Vestoria so-called reincarnation. (Zephyr vs Thanos to get Len for short)

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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Thu Dec 30, 2010 9:39 am

rin966 wrote:

It will be more funny if Zephyr is Aldius reincarnation! It will be worth see it. Aldius reincarnation vs Other self whom looks like Aldius to get Vestoria so-called reincarnation. (Zephyr vs Thanos to get Len for short)

That sounds amazing xD

Also, Zepher has green hair too o.o
I never thought of that Shocked

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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Thu Dec 30, 2010 9:45 am

Yeah Zephyr as Aldius' reincarnation.

But I'm kinda seeing a... deja vu? I don't know how to call it.

Because if Len is Vestoria's reincarnation, and Zephyr is Aldius's reincarnation, and Thanos is Oswald's other self... O.o Maybe the same love triangle will happen from back in RoT! XD

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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Thu Dec 30, 2010 9:47 am

Won't that make ZephyLen canon? XD

And Thanos end up with this random black-haired girl.

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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Thu Dec 30, 2010 9:51 am

You don't know. Very Happy
When Vestoria loved Aldius back in RoT, Oswald's jealous so he wanted to destroy the world-blah-blah-blah. To stop the evil thing-blah-blah-blah, Vestoria loved Oswald, right?

So kinda like Len loved Zephyr and Thanos is jealous so he wanted to ergh... do something evil against Zephyr (or anything evil whatever) so to protect Zephyr (or do something heroic), Len has to love Thanos.

CONFUSING. >.<

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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Thu Dec 30, 2010 11:42 am

When you talk about it I just remember Random Black Haired Girl in Main Menu. She is still a mystery....... Since there still no clue on it I leave it be.

Why ZephyrxLen not canon if my stupid random theory just for fun that somehow and miraculously the truth maybe?. Because Aldius get Old Hag in RoT. Then it is Thanos/Oswald turn to get some love. Did you really want to make Thanos failed the third time?

It looks like the thing Oswald want to destroy the world blah-blah-blah because Old Hag love Aldius so Oswald get rejected. It is not true 100%

Oswald ever said something beyond this line. "The mortals is blah-blah-blah it is too much for us (you-know-who) to handle. We are there not to serve the Mortals. We are the essence so we are the god. and blah-blah-blah so why don't we just rule them" so Oswald destroy the world because Old Hag loves Aldius is not fully true that reason is pop out later after Vestoria reject Oswald. So it is half true. (weird my head think fast very much today......)

LumenAstrum wrote:
So kinda like Len loved Zephyr and Thanos is jealous so he wanted to ergh... do something evil against Zephyr (or anything evil whatever) so to protect Zephyr (or do something heroic), Len has to love Thanos.

CONFUSING. >.<

What an interesting and half true theory. Even Len is indeed Old Hag reincarnation it didn't mean she must love Aldius reincarnation or so I said Zephyr (in my stupid random theory just for fun that somehow and miraculously the truth maybe?) reincarnation is a twisted thing you know. But, Len is not Vestoria, Old Hag is dead for real! Old Hag is already a mortal even in RoT (burn it in the mind) so even she still handle the "Birth Essence" job, she is can not do it alone like before. (Wanna proof? See RoTA, Valen will mention it after the meeting before she and Cheryl prepare for the journey) Maybe Immortal could make some arrangement so they can reborn with their past memory. (for example Thanos if he included as Immortal...... or not)
That was why Len have a free will to love someone not arranged by her past live and hopefully that spinning tragedy will not happen again.

Oh, anyway if we use theory that Len is Cheryl or Valen other self. It will make something more complicated. Why? there are some of my reason:
1. I doubt they can live that long in Leingold household. Oswald will kill it. (now I know why he do that.)
2. If Len indeed a second self. How she be a baby. Look at Thanos I don't know how old is he but I think he is really Old. (around 2100 years old maybe?) and we never get to see him as a baby *sob* so it is not possible Len foster mother found her outside the guild as a baby.
3. I bet Cheryl or Valen never see and think Old Hag is like Len now. (I mean she being a tomboy and so on an exact opposite of Vestoria we know. Ups, sorry Len)
4. Even Cheryl hope to be Old Hag. What is her reason? Is it because, she is the one Oswald love in the past? Hello, she even not 19 years old that time and she get Oswald around 16 years old. (The time she be an Immortal)
5. Then, How could Len just show up now? after 223 years after she should have been born??? Another reincarnation again??? At least if that true Valen or Cain will know about it.

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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Thu Dec 30, 2010 7:22 pm

Well, nobody can be right. Very Happy I initially thought before on my first playthrough that Thanos and Zephyr are only one person. I was like when I first saw Zephyr "Hey Isn't that Thanos with a mask? O_o"

Well, I was just saying things classified in "if" statements, like what will happen if this and that happened.

Maybe we will have more clues when Before Requiem gets released. C:

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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Thu Dec 30, 2010 10:54 pm

rin966 wrote:
It looks like Len get Old Hag memory and body

I don't think so. Len has Cheryl's memories, not Vestoria's (at least in the demo).

rin966 wrote:
It prove that Oswald is not die! That's why Thanos could show up in RoTA and be the main villain there.

Yeah, yeah, that's true. But then again, both Oswald and Aldius are immortals, which means they both can't die. Which means both other selves can be up and about as long as their originals are. I'm thinking, though, if Oswald dies (or vanishes, think True Ending) and returns as an immortal an year later, then why wouldn't Aldius also return as an immortal? Or Vestoria? The three are the same species, after all.

rin966 wrote:
It will be more funny if Zephyr is Aldius reincarnation! It will be worth see it. Aldius reincarnation vs Other self whom looks like Aldius to get Vestoria so-called reincarnation. (Zephyr vs Thanos to get Len for short)

I believe that reincarnation means to be reborn in the same physical form. And Thanos is cannon, which means Len will love him, so it won't be like Oswald's story. I dunno.

LumenAstrum wrote:
You don't know. Very Happy
When Vestoria loved Aldius back in RoT, Oswald's jealous so he wanted to destroy the world-blah-blah-blah. To stop the evil thing-blah-blah-blah, Vestoria loved Oswald, right?

So kinda like Len loved Zephyr and Thanos is jealous so he wanted to ergh... do something evil against Zephyr (or anything evil whatever) so to protect Zephyr (or do something heroic), Len has to love Thanos.

CONFUSING. >.<

No, Vestoria pretended to love him. And Thanos is cannon, which means Len will love him (more than Zephyr), so it won't be like Oswald's story. I dunno.

Rin, your theories confuse me.


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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Fri Dec 31, 2010 8:25 am

Thanos has no personal hatred towards Zephyr.

I've seen quite enough of those theories of Thanos trying to kill Zephyr because he loves Len and is jealous of Zephyr and blah blah. It's not in his character. XD""

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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Fri Dec 31, 2010 8:30 am

I'm not good at telling something, since I am always speak in short talk.

I'm just choose what is Len between two (maybe) possibilities. 1. Cheryl/Valen Second self 2. Vestoria reincarnation. And I choose the 2nd

I'm just insert random blabber and something weird talking about Zephyr is Aldius reincarnation. Somehow I think it will be worth watching them (Zephyr and Thanos) fighting because of their past life or something. (Oh, wait I just mean Zephyr. Thanos not included since he is always like that)

Aldius is turned into un-materialized essence I think. We never told that he choose to reborn again, just think like he is a wandering ghost. Isn't Vestoria give up her immortal life to seal Oswald? So, it means she became a mere mortal. I believe in RoT Thanos isn't die since Oswald just turned into semi-transparent mode and Thanos just sealed in the Realm. (Sometimes minor things is worth remembering...... ==")

Aldius second self..... We never met it (since I don't know he/she) in person because Oswald killed it right after it born. I even more doubt that Aldius and his second self ever meet each other. And it looks like none of Aldius or his second self choose to reborn.

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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Fri Dec 31, 2010 4:24 pm

~Kirroha wrote:
Thanos has no personal hatred towards Zephyr.

Ah sou?

Makes sense. I mean, when you talk to Thanos in the demo, he doesn't seem...very concerned that he's going to kill a member of one of the highest ranking families in the entirety of Fantasia. I guess you have perks being an other self of an immortal. That family is just merely an obstacle in Thanos' goal...for whatever reason Thanos has.

And by the way, I'm pretty sure that Thanos doesn't specify which Vanguardion he's killing...although due to pictures that azure has drawn, it looks like Zephyr, it could be his dad, Nero's dad, Nero, Nero's sister...anyone with Vanguardion blood pretty much. >D Just saying. ...then again, I am just basing this off memory...

Then again, if Thanos kills Zephyr, the fangirls will smother him, and then he'll kill them, and then thousands of new female demons will come to haunt and smite him back...XD Just kidding, they probably would be scared when they find out Thanos did it.


As far as Aldius goes, I kinda hope he's the merchant XD It's not like we've ever seen his face.
...at least, I'm pretty sure the merchant is a guy...
Or that he has some part in either BR or MoGF, for whatever reason.

Y'know,
MoGF doesn't have to parallel RoT at all with canon love interests, we just think that's nice, right? xD

----

Someone in the Zeph vs Thanos thread said they wanted me to say how I figured out why Len's appearance is how it is, but someone else mentioned it already. Very Happy

...but I guess...
if Thanos looks like Aldius because Oswald was jealous of Aldius for taking Vestoria, the girl he loved,
Len looks like Vestoria because Cheryl was jealous of Vestoria because Oswald like Vestoria before going to her.

I mean, Cheryl's jealousy of Vestoria was taken over 9000 in the Dark Ending in RoT, but it does have a basis in canon...
---
For other people, I was wondering, even though after 200 years of different generations, why does Nero look a lot like a red version of Ian, Forte look like a mix of Vahn and Leon, yet Zephyr looks nothing like Ian at all. I mean, for the longest time we thought he had Roughknight blood until that was proven wrong by azure...(doesn't help that Zephy and Gil like veggies either).
And why do the Tribe brothers look more like Cyrus than Volg, even though we all know Cyrus never had children...ah, well, I guess their mother or grandfather might've looked more like Cyrus, plus generations of breeding led it to be this way XD;

I don't even know what Albel looks like anymore XD

Of course, all of this theorizing will be put to rest eventually...

Kinda like how all the Umineko fan theories are going to be put to rest ...today.

Edit: I think I'll be taking this statement back. XD









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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Fri Dec 31, 2010 6:45 pm

~Kirroha wrote:
Thanos has no personal hatred towards Zephyr.

Yeah, and why should he? I mean, he's thousands of years old, and Zephyr is 17. As far as I'm concerned, Zeph hasn't done anything that might in some way present an obstacle in Thanos' way to world destruction, right?

lepapillonrouge wrote:

And by the way, I'm pretty sure that Thanos doesn't specify which Vanguardion he's killing...although due to pictures that azure has drawn, it looks like Zephyr, it could be his dad, Nero's dad, Nero, Nero's sister...anyone with Vanguardion blood pretty much. >D Just saying. ...then again, I am just basing this off memory...

I'm not sure if Thanos mentions Zephyr's name. If he doesn't (and I think he doesn't), then it gets interesting.

lepapillonrouge wrote:

if Thanos looks like Aldius because Oswald was jealous of Aldius for taking Vestoria, the girl he loved,
Len looks like Vestoria because Cheryl was jealous of Vestoria because Oswald like Vestoria before going to her.

I mean, Cheryl's jealousy of Vestoria was taken over 9000 in the Dark Ending in RoT, but it does have a basis in canon...


That sounds believable. But... Oswald was full of hatred, dominated by it. And Cheryl was full with love, at least in the True Ending, she didn't let jealousy control her. So, if Cheryl has an other self, I would say that it'd look like Oswald, because Cheryl was dedicated to him. Unlike Oswald, who was driven by the desire for revenge.

And theorizing is interesting. And fun! XD

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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Sat Jan 01, 2011 11:25 am

These are all interesting, and actually the answer in MOGF is much more simplier.
Anyway, Before Requiem also holds some answer that can add your theories more (or maybe turns it to be more confusing?).
One thing though, you forgot that Oswald didn't really died while both Aldius and Vestoria died, and not all character tells the truth, especially Thanos, because he is just that cunning.

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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Sat Jan 01, 2011 2:31 pm

Ah, really?

Well I guess I don't like too simple answers, but as long as there is a satisfactory answer, things shall be all right.

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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Sat Jan 01, 2011 3:22 pm

I think if we want to make some theory. Let's make some list of question since Aldius face now appeared! (Well, I think this page increased *Witch laugh*)
1. Where's Lenarche's family? Who is she?
2. Character secrets and so on... (e.g Behind Zeph's mask, why Shea is alive, and so on...) ps : we know why....
3. The main villain? (If you want to answer it...... me: *rolling eyes*)
4. Where's Oswald and .co?
(those 4 is in 1st page if you want to know)
5. Why Aldius appeared now after errr 2 years release? Any posibilities he has something to do with Len? Or he might be The Secret Merchant!!!
6. (If someone have clue) Who is the black haired girl in the main menu? (me : *hands off*)
Let's get some clue from RoT and RoTA!!!!

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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Sat Jan 01, 2011 6:08 pm

azureXtwilight wrote:
These are all interesting, and actually the answer in MOGF is much more simplier.
Anyway, Before Requiem also holds some answer that can add your theories more (or maybe turns it to be more confusing?).
One thing though, you forgot that Oswald didn't really died while both Aldius and Vestoria died, and not all character tells the truth, especially Thanos, because he is just that cunning.

I suppose so.... And we're probably never gonna think of it, right? XD By the way, how's BR going? =3

Damn you Thanos, you little liar~ coughIstillloveyoucough

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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Sat Jan 01, 2011 6:23 pm

azureXtwilight wrote:
These are all interesting, and actually the answer in MOGF is much more simplier.
Anyway, Before Requiem also holds some answer that can add your theories more (or maybe turns it to be more confusing?).
One thing though, you forgot that Oswald didn't really died while both Aldius and Vestoria died, and not all character tells the truth, especially Thanos, because he is just that cunning.

Hmm... that sounds a little better to hear, seeing that we have all thought up of interesting theories about MoGF.
And I know that we can either find more answers on our theories from BR or just add up to the painstakingly long list of theories and mysteries in MoGF. I hope it's not the latter. C:

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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Sat Jan 01, 2011 7:55 pm








Are my current thoughts.

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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Thu Jan 06, 2011 2:08 am

Hello everyone!
Nice to meet you all! *bows* (I'm new here)

Ummm......
Is there a chance that Zephyr is blind?

Because I don't think he can see through that mask.........

By the way, is it true that Alviss is a yandere?
Or is it just your theory?

(Sorry, if my theory about Zephyr seems stupid) Sorry!
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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Thu Jan 06, 2011 2:37 am

Hey there, Elemental Princess, and welcome on board~

I wouldn't think he's blind, given that he's a skilled fighter and all, but I see your point. Still, I think the mask has its holes for the eyes. Not exactly holes, but places where the material is thinner.

And as far as I'm concerned, it is confirmed Alviss is an yandere.
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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Thu Jan 06, 2011 2:51 am

Maybe......
But don't you think that if he is blind he would have adjusted to combat in his own way, ne? Question
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PostSubject: Re: Your theories about Grand Finale's hidden truth.   Thu Jan 06, 2011 2:56 am

Elemental Princess wrote:

Ummm......
Is there a chance that Zephyr is blind?

Because I don't think he can see through that mask.........
I'm not really sure. I mean the mask could be a cover up for his blind-ness. Your right who can see through that?

And since Zephyr is blind his senses are modified to make up for his sight. That may be the reason why he acts like he isn't blind at all and why he is better in combat. (Just running off that)

I'm rooting on him having three eyes. *is hopeful*


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